Wind Power Vs others.

I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt. PV panels. 6.00 Per watt.
I guess if you have lot's of scratch and don't have room for a wind machine PV panels are cool but for average Joe it seems like a huge waste of money.

"Drums" wrote in message

I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt.

Yes, but if your site lacks sufficient wind, your installation will be little more useful than a decoration. Sites with useful, dependable sunlight are far more common than sites with useful, reliable wind.
Vaughn

In article , "Drums" wrote:

I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt. PV panels. 6.00 Per watt.
I guess if you have lot's of scratch and don't have room for a wind machine PV panels are cool but for average Joe it seems like a huge waste of money.

You are not looking too closely, then, or just not thinking.
Home Built Wind - Less than $1.00 per watt ON DAYS WHEN THE WIND IS BLOWING FAST ENOUGH. But not too fast. And not too slow. Very few places have wind that is anything like consistent and reliable. Even fewer have such wind where you don't need a great deal of investment (which I suspect your "cost" is ignoring) in big honking tower. A few do, and in those places, it makes a lot of sense. Maintenance is not free, and is needed. Lightning strikes become more likely with a big tower, and can get rather expensive.
Sunshine can also be frustratingly absent, but is more reliably available on most sites than wind of just the right speed range to effectively make power. Thus, a kilowatt of installed solar panel tends to produce a lot more energy per year on most sites than a kilowatt of installed wind generator. A combination makes sense on some sites.
-- Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by

Vaughn wrote:

"Drums" wrote in message I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt.
Yes, but if your site lacks sufficient wind, your installation will be little more useful than a decoration. Sites with useful, dependable sunlight are far more common than sites with useful, reliable wind.
By all accounts, the a bigger bang for your buck (I'm reluctant to say

"biggest") is from hydro power. Of course, sites with (legally) useful, dependable, water are even less common than sites with useful wind. -- derek

Well, I am fortunate enough to live near a lake. There is always some wind. As for to much wind that's all in the design of the system unless you live in areas where it get's really bad. We never see winds in excess of 80 and that's very rare. As for maintenance I don't think most people would get a real benifit Unless they do their own anyway as I intend to. I still think PV's are way to expensive to justify Unless you are in a remote area and need off grid power. I have heard the argument about it's not about saving Money. That may be true if you have unlimited funds and want to impress your neighbor. I have concluded at least in my area that wind is the only way to go until the cost comes way down on Pv's.

"Ecnerwal" wrote in message

In article , "Drums" wrote:
I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt. PV panels. 6.00 Per watt.
I guess if you have lot's of scratch and don't have room for a wind machine PV panels are cool but for average Joe it seems like a huge waste of money.
You are not looking too closely, then, or just not thinking.
Home Built Wind - Less than $1.00 per watt ON DAYS WHEN THE WIND IS BLOWING FAST ENOUGH. But not too fast. And not too slow. Very few places have wind that is anything like consistent and reliable. Even fewer have such wind where you don't need a great deal of investment (which I suspect your "cost" is ignoring) in big honking tower. A few do, and in those places, it makes a lot of sense. Maintenance is not free, and is needed. Lightning strikes become more likely with a big tower, and can get rather expensive.
Sunshine can also be frustratingly absent, but is more reliably available on most sites than wind of just the right speed range to effectively make power. Thus, a kilowatt of installed solar panel tends to produce a lot more energy per year on most sites than a kilowatt of installed wind generator. A combination makes sense on some sites.
-- Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by

I have a decent running Brook in my back yard and im working on a Generator right now. ;o) I don't expect to get more then 50 watts out of it but what the hell it will be fun.
"Derek Broughton" wrote in message

Vaughn wrote:
"Drums" wrote in message I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt.
Yes, but if your site lacks sufficient wind, your installation will be little more useful than a decoration. Sites with useful, dependable sunlight are far more common than sites with useful, reliable wind.
By all accounts, the a bigger bang for your buck (I'm reluctant to say "biggest") is from hydro power. Of course, sites with (legally) useful, dependable, water are even less common than sites with useful wind. -- derek

Drums wrote:

I have a decent running Brook in my back yard and im working on a Generator right now. ;o) I don't expect to get more then 50 watts out of it but what the hell it will be fun.
"Derek Broughton" wrote in message
Vaughn wrote:
"Drums" wrote in message
I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt.
Yes, but if your site lacks sufficient wind, your installation will
be
little more useful than a decoration. Sites with useful, dependable sunlight are far more common than sites with useful, reliable wind.
By all accounts, the a bigger bang for your buck (I'm reluctant to say "biggest") is from hydro power. Of course, sites with (legally) useful, dependable, water are even less common than sites with useful wind. -- derek

As it is generating 24/7, even a modest 50 watts will give you the

equivalent of 200-300 watts of pv.

True that. I need to carfully Design this unit as when it rains good it moves twice the amount of Water!
"Charles Foot" wrote in message

Drums wrote: I have a decent running Brook in my back yard and im working on a Generator right now. ;o) I don't expect to get more then 50 watts out of it but what the hell it will be fun.
"Derek Broughton" wrote in message
Vaughn wrote:
"Drums" wrote in message
I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt.
Yes, but if your site lacks sufficient wind, your installation will
be
little more useful than a decoration. Sites with useful, dependable sunlight are far more common than sites with useful, reliable wind.
By all accounts, the a bigger bang for your buck (I'm reluctant to say "biggest") is from hydro power. Of course, sites with (legally) useful, dependable, water are even less common than sites with useful wind. -- derek

As it is generating 24/7, even a modest 50 watts will give you the equivalent of 200-300 watts of pv.

On Sun, 08 Jan 2006 17:34:36 GMT, "Drums" wrote:

Well, I am fortunate enough to live near a lake. There is always some wind. As for to much wind that's all in the design of the system unless you live in areas where it get's really bad. We never see winds in excess of 80 and that's very rare.

I'm unfortunate enough to live in a windless town (generally) alongside a park with large trees that block even that wind which we get. So everyone's situation varies. There is no doubt that given the right situation, wind power is financially competitive as a source of electricity, which is why huge wind farms have sprung up around the world, including here in New Zealand. But its little use for me personally.

As for maintenance I don't think most people would get a real benifit Unless they do their own anyway as I intend to.

Thta's fine if you have the ability. However, there are many people around the world getting the benefit of windpower, even from their own generators, who do not do their own maintenance.

I still think PV's are way to expensive to justify

It may depend how you "justify" anything. It might similarly be said that owning a car cannot be justified - using public transport or a bicycle is much cheaper. But many people own cars, or pleasure boats, without needing to justify them. Children are expensive - but not many people have a debate about "justifying" having them.

Unless you are in a remote area and need off grid power. I have heard the argument about it's not about saving Money.

In most places, don't even think it is an argument if you have access to grid power. Its a fact. But again, it depends whether "saving money" is your object. Even the laminates I imported from the US a year ago, at about $3.50 a watt after paying all freight, taxes and costs of having them framed, still do not compete with grid power by at least three orders of magnitude. But there can be other reasons for using solar power, including - * security of supply * a sense of living more lightly on the planet * a hobby or interest, akin to my other amateur radio hobby.

That may be true if you have unlimited funds and want to impress your neighbor.

I certainly don't want to impress my neighbour - in fact I would rather my neighbour DIDN'T know I had solar panels - he might only try to steal them. Nor do I think its anything to do with unlimited funds. Its more to do with the choices we make.

I have concluded at least in my area that wind is the only way to go until the cost comes way down on Pv's.

Whatever the cost of pv, if you can a) build your own wind generator and b) keep it serviced then it sounds like you are in a good place. Go for it! And tell us how you get on.
Eric

"Eric Sears" wrote in message

In most places, don't even think it is an argument if you have access to grid power. Its a fact. But again, it depends whether "saving money" is your object. Even the laminates I imported from the US a year ago, at about $3.50 a watt after paying all freight, taxes and costs of having them framed, still do not compete with grid power by at least three orders of magnitude. But there can be other reasons for using solar power, including - * security of supply * a sense of living more lightly on the planet * a hobby or interest, akin to my other amateur radio hobby.

I did use a PV once in an unauthorized fox hunt once. ;o) Using the Tree as an antenna it took a few months before it was found. ;o) I got to have fun with a few buddies and they got to keep my panel. ;o) Greetings from a fellow ham.

"Drums" wrote in message

I did use a PV once in an unauthorized fox hunt once. ;o) Using the Tree as an antenna it took a few months before it was found. ;o) I got to have fun with a few buddies and they got to keep my panel. ;o) Greetings from a fellow ham.

We used to have a monthly fox hunt here. I once buried a transmitter and a timer at the beach connected to a dipole just under the surface of the sand. Naturally, it didn't radiate much, so I started the hunt only a mile away from the "bunny". The hunters were in the area quickly, but then milled around for much of the evening. It was fun watching people standing over my antenna wondering why their DF was trying to point in all directions at once!
Vaughn WB4UHB

On Sun, 08 Jan 2006 16:22:13 GMT, "Drums" wrote:

I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt. PV panels. 6.00 Per watt.
I guess if you have lot's of scratch and don't have room for a wind machine PV panels are cool but for average Joe it seems like a huge waste of money.
If I had the proper site to install a wind generator, I would use it

to heat water. A small tank with a few elements installed to pre-heat the water located before the main tank. A solid state control would select the optimum load for maximum power, depending on the wind availability. If there was an excess of power I would use it to heat the house. Probably the most efficient way to store energy.
No batteries.

Let's look at this
You will need about 20,000 watts to heat your water and house?
I would think a generator that size would run you about $200K and a cheap tower maybe $60K
Maybe you could buy a machine shop and motor winding shop for that and make your own.
I hope y'all like cold showers....LOL
"Canfree" wrote in message

On Sun, 08 Jan 2006 16:22:13 GMT, "Drums" tgiorgi1@REMOVEnycap.rr.com> wrote:
I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt. PV panels. 6.00 Per watt.
I guess if you have lot's of scratch and don't have room for a wind machine PV panels are cool but for average Joe it seems like a huge waste of money.
If I had the proper site to install a wind generator, I would use it to heat water. A small tank with a few elements installed to pre-heat the water located before the main tank. A solid state control would select the optimum load for maximum power, depending on the wind availability. If there was an excess of power I would use it to heat the house. Probably the most efficient way to store energy.
No batteries.

Damn good idea. You could use for house heat as well.
"Canfree" wrote in message

On Sun, 08 Jan 2006 16:22:13 GMT, "Drums" tgiorgi1@REMOVEnycap.rr.com> wrote:
I have been doing research into alternative energy and it seems that you get the biggest bang for your buck with wind power especially if you build your own.
Home built wind. Less then 1.00 per watt. PV panels. 6.00 Per watt.
I guess if you have lot's of scratch and don't have room for a wind machine PV panels are cool but for average Joe it seems like a huge waste of money.
If I had the proper site to install a wind generator, I would use it to heat water. A small tank with a few elements installed to pre-heat the water located before the main tank. A solid state control would select the optimum load for maximum power, depending on the wind availability. If there was an excess of power I would use it to heat the house. Probably the most efficient way to store energy.
No batteries.

Brilliant! The trees had a simmaler effect. If it was damp forget it. You had to be right on it.
"Vaughn" wrote in message

"Drums" wrote in message
I did use a PV once in an unauthorized fox hunt once. ;o) Using the Tree as an antenna it took a few months before it was found. ;o) I got to have fun with a few buddies and they got to keep my panel. ;o) Greetings from a fellow ham.
We used to have a monthly fox hunt here. I once buried a transmitter and a timer at the beach connected to a dipole just under the surface of the sand. Naturally, it didn't radiate much, so I started the hunt only a mile away from the "bunny". The hunters were in the area quickly, but then milled around for much of the evening. It was fun watching people standing over my antenna wondering why their DF was trying to point in all directions at once!
Vaughn WB4UHB