135,000 powered off by winter storm in Iowa -- No Hydrogen-F

http://www.wqad.com/Global/story.asp?S=6137367&nav=1sW7
Winter storm leaves more than 100k without power
DES MOINES, Iowa More than 100-thousand customers are without power as a powerful winter storm punches its way across Iowa.
MidAmerican Energy is reporting 50-thousand customers without power. Alliant Energy is reporting 85-thousand outages.
Officials from both companies say it could take days to restore power to some customers.
They say the outages were caused by freezing rain that coated power lines and poles, which snapped under the weight of the ice.
Meanwhile, the National Weather Service has issued a blizzard warning for parts of north-central and northeast Iowa, where up to a foot of snow is expected.
The weather service says whiteout conditions can be expected with drifting up to three feet high.
A winter storm warning is in effect in areas of northern and central Iowa, where up to seven inches of snow is forecast.
Travel is not advised across much of the state tonight and tomorrow.

http://desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070224/NEWS/702240348/1001/SiteMap
Utility officials: 170,000 Iowa customers without power BY JARED STRONG, KEN FUSON, LIZ OWENS AND THOMAS BARTON REGISTER STAFF WRITERS
February 24, 2007 22 Comments
A dangerous winter's brew of freezing rain, high winds, sleet and snow has resulted in treacherous travel conditions and mounting power outages throughout the state.
At least 170,000 Iowa customers were without power as of 8:30 p.m., a number that is expected to increase as more snow sweeps across the state tonight and Sunday.
"It's a situation in which we're not talking about outage restoration time in number of hours," said Ryan Stensland, a spokesman for Alliant, which serves about 500,000 residents in 77 Iowa counties.
"We're talking about this in number of days."
Alliant reported 109,000 customers without power tonight, while MidAmerican Energy, which serves the Des Moines metropolian area, Iowa City, Waterloo and the Quad Cities, said about 63,000 customers were without power.
Towns hardest hit include Newton, 9,000 customers; Marshalltown, 8,000 customers;; Grinnell, 7,000 customers; the Quad Cities, 20,000; Iowa City, 9,200; Waterloo, 13,000; and Burlington, 7,500.
With authorities urging Iowans to stay home, hundreds of events were cancelled or postponed across the state, from Saturday night church services to several Iowa Girls High School Athletic Union games. But the state wrestling meet's championship matches continued as scheduled tonight at Wells Fargo Arena in Des Moines.
Fans Carl and Amy Snook of Davenport, who traveled to the meet with six Davenport West High School cheerleaders, had planned to leave Des Moines during the day. But the storm caused a change in their departure -- they booked hotel rooms late Saturday morning.
"We've been up here since Thursday, we were going to leave (Saturday)," Carl Snook said.
Instead, they made arrangements to watch tonights championships and remain off the roads.
"And we might be here until Monday," Amy Snook said, laughing.
Iowa High School Athletic Association executive director Rick Wulkow said meet officials planned to make weather and travel announcements to the crowd.
Wulkow said fans were being urged to use good judgment in traveling through snow and icy conditions.
National Weather Service meteorologists said rain and freezing rain would turn into show tonight and into Sunday.
"This very well could be the worst winter storm we've seen this year, in terms of the overall impact," said Rich Kinney, a meteorologist with the National Weather Service in Johnston.
Polk County could see between 5 and 8 inches of total snow by noon Sunday.
Northern Iowa could see much more, with cities like Algona expected to get as much as a foot of snow. The winter storm warning expires at noon Sunday for Des Moines.
A blizzard warning is in effect for northeast Iowa until Sunday afternoon, while southeast Iowa faces an ice storm warning into Sunday.
The combination of ice and strong winds snapped power lines and tree limbs.
More than 30 downed power lines forced the closure of Interstate Highway 80 east of Iowa City and two highways in northeast Iowa.
Officials closed east- and westbound lanes of traffic on I-80 about 1:30 p.m., between mile markers 254 and 277. They did not know long it would be closed.
Officials are routing eastbound traffic around about seven miles of U.S. Highway 20, east of Waterloo -- from Jesup to Independence. Drivers are being directed north on V-65 to Jesup, then east to Independence and south back to Highway 20.
In northern Iowa, about 11 miles of U.S. Highway 218 was closed Saturday -- from Highway 9 to Floyd -- due to at least 30 downed lines.
"Don't drive if you can plan around it or avoid it," said Will Zitterich, assistant maintenance director with the Iowa Department of Transportation. "It could be a very treacherous weekend."
Despite the freezlng slush on roads and snow that began after dark, Iowa State Patrol offices around the state reported no serious accidents as of 9 p.m.
At least six flights scheduled to arrive at Des Moines airport Saturday were canceled, by United, American and Northwest airlines. Four flights leaving Des Moines scheduled for Chicago, Minneapolis and Denver also had been canceled.
At about 5 p.m. Saturday, United Airlines' Web site showed that all six flights to Chicago from Des Moines today had already been canceled.
Flight schedules for the airport can be checked at www.dsmairport.com.
The worst conditions will be north of Des Moines, Kinney said.
He said residents could see problems with downed power lines and tree limbs as they wake up this morning.
"It may not seem like much, but you can imagine coating power lines and trees limbs with a half inch of ice - the weight will definitely down power lines and tree limbs," Kinney said.
Allan Urlis, a spokesman for MidAmerican Energy, said electrical crews were ready to respond to power outages.
"Ice is more of a concern than heavy snow is," Urlis said.
"It depends on the combination of ice and wind, but our power lines are built to withstand half an inch of ice combined with 40-mph winds. But there may be areas where there are weaknesses in the system because of previous weather or age.
"We have tree-trimming programs where we trim trees near power lines. But with ice, even properly trimmed trees could take out a power line."
Urlis said he encourages customers to help out crews by calling in and reporting power outages. "The more info we have, the better we're able to identify the cause of the problem, where equipment has failed and where to mobilize crews," he said.
The rain is expected to change quickly to snow from north to south, starting this afternoon. The snow will be accompanied by strong winds. Visibility could be greatly reduced by blowing and drifting snow, which could lead to blizzard conditions.
The Iowa Department of Transportation is urging motorists to stay off the roadways if at all possible.
"Don't drive if you can plan around it to avoid it," said Will Zitterich, assistant maintenance director with the DOT. "It could be a very treacherous weekend."

I am very sorry for the people....
I think it will get worse in the future, probably 7X worse than now..

"Hydrogen TRUTH" wrote in message

http://desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070224/NEWS/702240348/1001/SiteMap
Utility officials: 170,000 Iowa customers without power BY JARED STRONG, KEN FUSON, LIZ OWENS AND THOMAS BARTON REGISTER STAFF WRITERS
February 24, 2007 22 Comments
A dangerous winter's brew of freezing rain, high winds, sleet and snow has resulted in treacherous travel conditions and mounting power outages throughout the state.
At least 170,000 Iowa customers were without power as of 8:30 p.m., a number that is expected to increase as more snow sweeps across the state tonight and Sunday.
"It's a situation in which we're not talking about outage restoration time in number of hours," said Ryan Stensland, a spokesman for Alliant, which serves about 500,000 residents in 77 Iowa counties.
"We're talking about this in number of days."
Alliant reported 109,000 customers without power tonight, while MidAmerican Energy, which serves the Des Moines metropolian area, Iowa City, Waterloo and the Quad Cities, said about 63,000 customers were without power.
Towns hardest hit include Newton, 9,000 customers; Marshalltown, 8,000 customers;; Grinnell, 7,000 customers; the Quad Cities, 20,000; Iowa City, 9,200; Waterloo, 13,000; and Burlington, 7,500.
With authorities urging Iowans to stay home, hundreds of events were cancelled or postponed across the state, from Saturday night church services to several Iowa Girls High School Athletic Union games. But the state wrestling meet's championship matches continued as scheduled tonight at Wells Fargo Arena in Des Moines.
Fans Carl and Amy Snook of Davenport, who traveled to the meet with six Davenport West High School cheerleaders, had planned to leave Des Moines during the day. But the storm caused a change in their departure -- they booked hotel rooms late Saturday morning.
"We've been up here since Thursday, we were going to leave (Saturday)," Carl Snook said.
Instead, they made arrangements to watch tonights championships and remain off the roads.
"And we might be here until Monday," Amy Snook said, laughing.
Iowa High School Athletic Association executive director Rick Wulkow said meet officials planned to make weather and travel announcements to the crowd.
Wulkow said fans were being urged to use good judgment in traveling through snow and icy conditions.
National Weather Service meteorologists said rain and freezing rain would turn into show tonight and into Sunday.
"This very well could be the worst winter storm we've seen this year, in terms of the overall impact," said Rich Kinney, a meteorologist with the National Weather Service in Johnston.
Polk County could see between 5 and 8 inches of total snow by noon Sunday.
Northern Iowa could see much more, with cities like Algona expected to get as much as a foot of snow. The winter storm warning expires at noon Sunday for Des Moines.
A blizzard warning is in effect for northeast Iowa until Sunday afternoon, while southeast Iowa faces an ice storm warning into Sunday.
The combination of ice and strong winds snapped power lines and tree limbs.
More than 30 downed power lines forced the closure of Interstate Highway 80 east of Iowa City and two highways in northeast Iowa.
Officials closed east- and westbound lanes of traffic on I-80 about 1:30 p.m., between mile markers 254 and 277. They did not know long it would be closed.
Officials are routing eastbound traffic around about seven miles of U.S. Highway 20, east of Waterloo -- from Jesup to Independence. Drivers are being directed north on V-65 to Jesup, then east to Independence and south back to Highway 20.
In northern Iowa, about 11 miles of U.S. Highway 218 was closed Saturday -- from Highway 9 to Floyd -- due to at least 30 downed lines.
"Don't drive if you can plan around it or avoid it," said Will Zitterich, assistant maintenance director with the Iowa Department of Transportation. "It could be a very treacherous weekend."
Despite the freezlng slush on roads and snow that began after dark, Iowa State Patrol offices around the state reported no serious accidents as of 9 p.m.
At least six flights scheduled to arrive at Des Moines airport Saturday were canceled, by United, American and Northwest airlines. Four flights leaving Des Moines scheduled for Chicago, Minneapolis and Denver also had been canceled.
At about 5 p.m. Saturday, United Airlines' Web site showed that all six flights to Chicago from Des Moines today had already been canceled.
Flight schedules for the airport can be checked at www.dsmairport.com.
The worst conditions will be north of Des Moines, Kinney said.
He said residents could see problems with downed power lines and tree limbs as they wake up this morning.
"It may not seem like much, but you can imagine coating power lines and trees limbs with a half inch of ice - the weight will definitely down power lines and tree limbs," Kinney said.
Allan Urlis, a spokesman for MidAmerican Energy, said electrical crews were ready to respond to power outages.
"Ice is more of a concern than heavy snow is," Urlis said.
"It depends on the combination of ice and wind, but our power lines are built to withstand half an inch of ice combined with 40-mph winds. But there may be areas where there are weaknesses in the system because of previous weather or age.
"We have tree-trimming programs where we trim trees near power lines. But with ice, even properly trimmed trees could take out a power line."
Urlis said he encourages customers to help out crews by calling in and reporting power outages. "The more info we have, the better we're able to identify the cause of the problem, where equipment has failed and where to mobilize crews," he said.
The rain is expected to change quickly to snow from north to south, starting this afternoon. The snow will be accompanied by strong winds. Visibility could be greatly reduced by blowing and drifting snow, which could lead to blizzard conditions.
The Iowa Department of Transportation is urging motorists to stay off the roadways if at all possible.
"Don't drive if you can plan around it to avoid it," said Will Zitterich, assistant maintenance director with the DOT. "It could be a very treacherous weekend."

And 'fuel cells' are supposed to solve what problem exactly? How much do they cost?

On Feb 24, 11:39 pm, "Hydrogen TRUTH" wrote:

http://desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070224/NEWS...
Utility officials: 170,000 Iowa customers without power BY JARED STRONG, KEN FUSON, LIZ OWENS AND THOMAS BARTON REGISTER STAFF WRITERS
February 24, 2007 22 Comments
A dangerous winter's brew of freezing rain, high winds, sleet and snow has resulted in treacherous travel conditions and mounting power outages throughout the state.
At least 170,000 Iowa customers were without power as of 8:30 p.m., a number that is expected to increase as more snow sweeps across the state tonight and Sunday.
"It's a situation in which we're not talking about outage restoration time in number of hours," said Ryan Stensland, a spokesman for Alliant, which serves about 500,000 residents in 77 Iowa counties.
"We're talking about this in number of days."
Alliant reported 109,000 customers without power tonight, while MidAmerican Energy, which serves the Des Moines metropolian area, Iowa City, Waterloo and the Quad Cities, said about 63,000 customers were without power.
Towns hardest hit include Newton, 9,000 customers; Marshalltown, 8,000 customers;; Grinnell, 7,000 customers; the Quad Cities, 20,000; Iowa City, 9,200; Waterloo, 13,000; and Burlington, 7,500.
With authorities urging Iowans to stay home, hundreds of events were cancelled or postponed across the state, from Saturday night church services to several Iowa Girls High School Athletic Union games. But the state wrestling meet's championship matches continued as scheduled tonight at Wells Fargo Arena in Des Moines.
Fans Carl and Amy Snook of Davenport, who traveled to the meet with six Davenport West High School cheerleaders, had planned to leave Des Moines during the day. But the storm caused a change in their departure -- they booked hotel rooms late Saturday morning.
"We've been up here since Thursday, we were going to leave (Saturday)," Carl Snook said.
Instead, they made arrangements to watch tonights championships and remain off the roads.
"And we might be here until Monday," Amy Snook said, laughing.
Iowa High School Athletic Association executive director Rick Wulkow said meet officials planned to make weather and travel announcements to the crowd.
Wulkow said fans were being urged to use good judgment in traveling through snow and icy conditions.
National Weather Service meteorologists said rain and freezing rain would turn into show tonight and into Sunday.
"This very well could be the worst winter storm we've seen this year, in terms of the overall impact," said Rich Kinney, a meteorologist with the National Weather Service in Johnston.
Polk County could see between 5 and 8 inches of total snow by noon Sunday.
Northern Iowa could see much more, with cities like Algona expected to get as much as a foot of snow. The winter storm warning expires at noon Sunday for Des Moines.
A blizzard warning is in effect for northeast Iowa until Sunday afternoon, while southeast Iowa faces an ice storm warning into Sunday.
The combination of ice and strong winds snapped power lines and tree limbs.
More than 30 downed power lines forced the closure of Interstate Highway 80 east of Iowa City and two highways in northeast Iowa.
Officials closed east- and westbound lanes of traffic on I-80 about 1:30 p.m., between mile markers 254 and 277. They did not know long it would be closed.
Officials are routing eastbound traffic around about seven miles of U.S. Highway 20, east of Waterloo -- from Jesup to Independence. Drivers are being directed north on V-65 to Jesup, then east to Independence and south back to Highway 20.
In northern Iowa, about 11 miles of U.S. Highway 218 was closed Saturday -- from Highway 9 to Floyd -- due to at least 30 downed lines.
"Don't drive if you can plan around it or avoid it," said Will Zitterich, assistant maintenance director with the Iowa Department of Transportation. "It could be a very treacherous weekend."
Despite the freezlng slush on roads and snow that began after dark, Iowa State Patrol offices around the state reported no serious accidents as of 9 p.m.
At least six flights scheduled to arrive at Des Moines airport Saturday were canceled, by United, American and Northwest airlines. Four flights leaving Des Moines scheduled for Chicago, Minneapolis and Denver also had been canceled.
At about 5 p.m. Saturday, United Airlines' Web site showed that all six flights to Chicago from Des Moines today had already been canceled.
Flight schedules for the airport can be checked atwww.dsmairport.com.
The worst conditions will be north of Des Moines, Kinney said.
He said residents could see problems with downed power lines and tree limbs as they wake up this morning.
"It may not seem like much, but you can imagine coating power lines and trees limbs with a half inch of ice - the weight will definitely down power lines and tree limbs," Kinney said.
Allan Urlis, a spokesman for MidAmerican Energy, said electrical crews were ready to respond to power outages.
"Ice is more of a concern than heavy snow is," Urlis said.
"It depends on the combination of ice and wind, but our power lines are built to withstand half an inch of ice combined with 40-mph winds. But there may be areas where there are weaknesses in the system because of previous weather or age.
"We have tree-trimming programs where we trim trees near power lines. But with ice, even properly trimmed trees could take out a power line."
Urlis said he encourages customers to help out crews by calling in and reporting power outages. "The more info we have, the better we're able to identify the cause of the problem, where equipment has failed and where to mobilize crews," he said.
The rain is expected to change quickly to snow from north to south, starting this afternoon. The snow will be accompanied by strong winds. Visibility could be greatly reduced by blowing and drifting snow, which could lead to blizzard conditions.
The Iowa Department of Transportation is urging motorists to stay off the roadways if at all possible.
"Don't drive if you can plan around it to avoid it," said Will Zitterich, assistant maintenance director with the DOT. "It could be a very treacherous weekend."

On Feb 25, 11:48 pm, "Corporate Shill Catcher" wrote:

On Feb 24, 11:39 pm, "Hydrogen TRUTH" wrote:

http://desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070224/NEWS...
Utility officials: 170,000 Iowa customers without power BY JARED STRONG, KEN FUSON, LIZ OWENS AND THOMAS BARTON REGISTER STAFF WRITERS
February 24, 2007 22 Comments
A dangerous winter's brew of freezing rain, high winds, sleet and snow has resulted in treacherous travel conditions and mounting power outages throughout the state.
At least 170,000 Iowa customers were without power as of 8:30 p.m., a number that is expected to increase as more snow sweeps across the state tonight and Sunday.
"It's a situation in which we're not talking about outage restoration time in number of hours," said Ryan Stensland, a spokesman for Alliant, which serves about 500,000 residents in 77 Iowa counties.
"We're talking about this in number of days."
Alliant reported 109,000 customers without power tonight, while MidAmerican Energy, which serves the Des Moines metropolian area, Iowa City, Waterloo and the Quad Cities, said about 63,000 customers were without power.
Towns hardest hit include Newton, 9,000 customers; Marshalltown, 8,000 customers;; Grinnell, 7,000 customers; the Quad Cities, 20,000; Iowa City, 9,200; Waterloo, 13,000; and Burlington, 7,500.
With authorities urging Iowans to stay home, hundreds of events were cancelled or postponed across the state, from Saturday night church services to several Iowa Girls High School Athletic Union games. But the state wrestling meet's championship matches continued as scheduled tonight at Wells Fargo Arena in Des Moines.
Fans Carl and Amy Snook of Davenport, who traveled to the meet with six Davenport West High School cheerleaders, had planned to leave Des Moines during the day. But the storm caused a change in their departure -- they booked hotel rooms late Saturday morning.
"We've been up here since Thursday, we were going to leave (Saturday)," Carl Snook said.
Instead, they made arrangements to watch tonights championships and remain off the roads.
"And we might be here until Monday," Amy Snook said, laughing.
Iowa High School Athletic Association executive director Rick Wulkow said meet officials planned to make weather and travel announcements to the crowd.
Wulkow said fans were being urged to use good judgment in traveling through snow and icy conditions.
National Weather Service meteorologists said rain and freezing rain would turn into show tonight and into Sunday.
"This very well could be the worst winter storm we've seen this year, in terms of the overall impact," said Rich Kinney, a meteorologist with the National Weather Service in Johnston.
Polk County could see between 5 and 8 inches of total snow by noon Sunday.
Northern Iowa could see much more, with cities like Algona expected to get as much as a foot of snow. The winter storm warning expires at noon Sunday for Des Moines.
A blizzard warning is in effect for northeast Iowa until Sunday afternoon, while southeast Iowa faces an ice storm warning into Sunday.
The combination of ice and strong winds snapped power lines and tree limbs.
More than 30 downed power lines forced the closure of Interstate Highway 80 east of Iowa City and two highways in northeast Iowa.
Officials closed east- and westbound lanes of traffic on I-80 about 1:30 p.m., between mile markers 254 and 277. They did not know long it would be closed.
Officials are routing eastbound traffic around about seven miles of U.S. Highway 20, east of Waterloo -- from Jesup to Independence. Drivers are being directed north on V-65 to Jesup, then east to Independence and south back to Highway 20.
In northern Iowa, about 11 miles of U.S. Highway 218 was closed Saturday -- from Highway 9 to Floyd -- due to at least 30 downed lines.
"Don't drive if you can plan around it or avoid it," said Will Zitterich, assistant maintenance director with the Iowa Department of Transportation. "It could be a very treacherous weekend."
Despite the freezlng slush on roads and snow that began after dark, Iowa State Patrol offices around the state reported no serious accidents as of 9 p.m.
At least six flights scheduled to arrive at Des Moines airport Saturday were canceled, by United, American and Northwest airlines. Four flights leaving Des Moines scheduled for Chicago, Minneapolis and Denver also had been canceled.
At about 5 p.m. Saturday, United Airlines' Web site showed that all six flights to Chicago from Des Moines today had already been canceled.
Flight schedules for the airport can be checked atwww.dsmairport.com.
The worst conditions will be north of Des Moines, Kinney said.
He said residents could see problems with downed power lines and tree limbs as they wake up this morning.
"It may not seem like much, but you can imagine coating power lines and trees limbs with a half inch of ice - the weight will definitely down power lines and tree limbs," Kinney said.
Allan Urlis, a spokesman for MidAmerican Energy, said electrical crews were ready to respond to power outages.
"Ice is more of a concern than heavy snow is," Urlis said.
"It depends on the combination of ice and wind, but our power lines are built to withstand half an inch of ice combined with 40-mph winds. But there may be areas where there are weaknesses in the system because of previous weather or age.
"We have tree-trimming programs where we trim trees near power lines. But with ice, even properly trimmed trees could take out a power line."
Urlis said he encourages customers to help out crews by calling in and reporting power outages. "The more info we have, the better we're able to identify the cause of the problem, where equipment has failed and where to mobilize crews," he said.
The rain is expected to change quickly to snow from north to south, starting this afternoon. The snow will be accompanied by strong winds. Visibility could be greatly reduced by blowing and drifting snow, which could lead to blizzard conditions.
The Iowa Department of Transportation is urging motorists to stay off the roadways if at all possible.
"Don't drive if you can plan around it to avoid it," said Will Zitterich, assistant maintenance director with the DOT. "It could be a very treacherous weekend."- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

On Feb 24, 6:51 pm, "Why DON'T You Want Energy Security?" wrote:

http://www.wqad.com/Global/story.asp?S=6137367&nav=1sW7
Winter storm leaves more than 100k without power
DES MOINES, Iowa More than 100-thousand customers are without power as a powerful winter storm punches its way across Iowa.
MidAmerican Energy is reporting 50-thousand customers without power. Alliant Energy is reporting 85-thousand outages.
Officials from both companies say it could take days to restore power to some customers.
They say the outages were caused by freezing rain that coated power lines and poles, which snapped under the weight of the ice.
Meanwhile, the National Weather Service has issued a blizzard warning for parts of north-central and northeast Iowa, where up to a foot of snow is expected.
The weather service says whiteout conditions can be expected with drifting up to three feet high.
A winter storm warning is in effect in areas of northern and central Iowa, where up to seven inches of snow is forecast.
Travel is not advised across much of the state tonight and tomorrow.

I repeat: "And 'fuel cells' are supposed to solve what problem exactly? How much do they cost?" Does anyone have an answer????
David

In article , theloneranger100@aol.com says...

I am very sorry for the people....
I think it will get worse in the future, probably 7X worse than now..

Yes.
And such things occur because of the long-time tearing down of the energy infrastructure. No nukeplants are built either. This is part of a "green" warfare against the people everywhere, those in the poor countries and those in the "rich" ones too. A hydrogen thing is rather irrelevant today, though.
Rolf M. www.rolf-martens.com

"Hydrogen TRUTH" wrote in message
http://desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070224/NEWS/702240348

/1001/SiteMap

Utility officials: 170,000 Iowa customers without power BY JARED STRONG, KEN FUSON, LIZ OWENS AND THOMAS BARTON REGISTER STAFF WRITERS
February 24, 2007 22 Comments
A dangerous winter's brew of freezing rain, high winds, sleet and snow has resulted in treacherous travel conditions and mounting power outages throughout the state.
At least 170,000 Iowa customers were without power as of 8:30 p.m., a number that is expected to increase as more snow sweeps across the state tonight and Sunday.

"Why DON'T You Want Energy Security?" wrote

DES MOINES, Iowa More than 100-thousand customers are without power as a powerful winter storm punches its way across Iowa.

The more AmeriKKKa deregulates it's power generation systems, the more unreliable and costly they become.
This was predicted long before the Fascist KKKonservative push into privatized utilities.
Is there anything these KKKonservatives have touched that they haven't fucked up, destroyed, murdered, broken, or mismanaged?
The sheer incompetence of the AmeriKKKan state is astonishing.
Hence the Campaign to Exterminate the Fascist AmeriKKKan state continues.

"Rolf Martens" wrote

And such things occur because of the long-time tearing down of the energy infrastructure. No nukeplants are built either. This is part of a "green" warfare against the people everywhere, those in the poor countries and those in the "rich" ones too. A hydrogen thing is rather irrelevant today, though.

Well Rolf, you could always turn off a lightbulb you Incompetent Moron.

wrote in message

I repeat: "And 'fuel cells' are supposed to solve what problem exactly?

Well Dave. You see, using a fuel cell allows you to generate your power locally and not be subjected to the poor quality of the now dregulated power system.

On Apr 6, 3:35 am, "Vendicar Decarian" wrote:

dave.walt...@comcast.net> wrote in message

I repeat: "And 'fuel cells' are supposed to solve what problem exactly?
Well Dave. You see, using a fuel cell allows you to generate your power locally and not be subjected to the poor quality of the now dregulated power system.

There is an intentional atomization of society through deregulation. I was involved in fighting dereguluation in California 7 years ago.
On the other hand, the big corps like to keep everyone hooked up to their power grid as well.
My view is that finding these individual solutions to the problems of the energy crisis is only going to push and pull civilizaiton apart...where those that can afford fuel cells and decentralization power systems will be the haves, and the have nots are everyone still tied to the grid.
We need to reregulate and expand municipal control over power production and the grid.
DAvid

On Feb 26, 7:21 am, dave.walt...@comcast.net wrote:

I repeat: "And 'fuel cells' are supposed to solve what problem exactly? How much do they cost?" Does anyone have an answer????
David

No, no one knows the cost, because the products are unavailable on the market at this time. still in R+D stages for technical possibility, let alone economic viability.

On Feb 26, 4:21 am, dave.walt...@comcast.net wrote:

I repeat: "And 'fuel cells' are supposed to solve what problem exactly? How much do they cost?" Does anyone have an answer????
David

They cost proportional to the mass production volumes. One-off, hand made experimental models are for the very rich, WalMart models are for anybody and not cheap but not more expensive than what they replace.
There are five essentially different fuel cell technologies: the one talked about for cars power plants are the most expensive, because they use precious metals as catalysts to keep the weight and bulk down. Molten Carbonate uses nickle electrodes which costs a "nickle" (relatively speaking, non-precious metal) and Solid-Oxide fuel cells use zirconium ceramics which is pennies. The Fuel Cell replace heating/cooling furnace equipment, water heater and plug power electricity, so they earn their place by displacing those expenses.
Iowa is adjacent to the windfields of middle America, on the route of pipelines going to Chicago and points east.
Buried pipelines do not crumble in ice storms. Intermittent power, such as wind, is ideal for conversion to H2. Pipelines cost $600k to $900K per mile installed, where towers cost $1,500K per mile (current 2007 prices). Since H2 can provide the heating/cooling, water-heating and lighting all for one fuel bill, plus run your car at some point, avoiding the VULNERABLE 2x to 3x cost of towers moving electrons from the barrens is justified by conversion to gas H2.