Rebuildable batteries

Something came to mind in the interest of having electric cars charged by renewable power. Maybe we could have rebuildable batteries, where the cost of the battery is paid for over time. It seems like a shame to just recycle, when we could rebuild. Maybe this would make some of the cost figures easier to deal with.

SJC wrote:

Something came to mind in the interest of having electric cars charged by renewable power. Maybe we could have rebuildable batteries, where the cost of the battery is paid for over time. It seems like a shame to just recycle, when we could rebuild. Maybe this would make some of the cost figures easier to deal with.

I don't understand your suggestion. What do you mean by "rebuildable"? What is the difference between recycling and rebuilding?
Are you suggesting that an EV battery be designed so that it can be easily taken apart, the parts which have worn out (plates?) replaced and then put back together again? Just how much of a worn out old battery can you use as-is in building a new unit?
Anthony

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:01:15 -0700, Anthony Matonak wrote:

SJC wrote: Something came to mind in the interest of having electric cars charged by renewable power. Maybe we could have rebuildable batteries, where the cost of the battery is paid for over time. It seems like a shame to just recycle, when we could rebuild. Maybe this would make some of the cost figures easier to deal with.
I don't understand your suggestion. What do you mean by "rebuildable"? What is the difference between recycling and rebuilding?

In recycling the materials are melted and used along with new material to make new batteries.

Are you suggesting that an EV battery be designed so that it can be easily taken apart, the parts which have worn out (plates?) replaced and then put back together again? Just how much of a worn out old battery can you use as-is in building a new unit? Anthony

There have been rebuilding operations for car batteries, the plates don't always wear out, material flakes off and falls to the bottom shorting out a cell. So the plates are just removed, rinsed, and put back in the cleaned case or in another case.
This has limitations though, and the result is naturally not as good as a new battery.
The spiral wound battery doesn't have a liquid electrolyte, it has a gel, and lasts much longer and has more power, maybe 1000 cranking amps compared to 600 to 800 for a lead acid. I have had mine for 5 years of an 8 year warranty, so I don't yet know how they fail or how long it will last.
I think it's only weak point is that a fast charge will damage it as it will not tolerate gassing as a lead acid battery does.
I think submarines use batteries that have extra electrolyte in tanks and circulate it through the chamber containing the plates which may give more storage with less lead, but literature on this may be hard to find.
The secret to battery life is not running it all the way down, and this is another plus for the hybrid vehicle.
Joe Fischer

"Anthony Matonak" wrote in message

SJC wrote: Something came to mind in the interest of having electric cars charged by renewable power. Maybe we could have rebuildable batteries, where the cost of the battery is paid for over time. It seems like a shame to just recycle, when we could rebuild. Maybe this would make some of the cost figures easier to deal with.
I don't understand your suggestion. What do you mean by "rebuildable"? What is the difference between recycling and rebuilding?
Are you suggesting that an EV battery be designed so that it can be easily taken apart, the parts which have worn out (plates?) replaced and then put back together again? Just how much of a worn out old battery can you use as-is in building a new unit?
Anthony

I guess I was just wondering what wears out in a battery and if it would be possible to restore that part of the battery. It might not be possible, but if a battery bank has 1000 deep cycles in it and you use it everyday, then it could get quite expensive.

On 8/25/2006 12:00 PM, SJC wrote:

"Anthony Matonak" wrote in message SJC wrote: Something came to mind in the interest of having electric cars charged by renewable power. Maybe we could have rebuildable batteries, where the cost of the battery is paid for over time. It seems like a shame to just recycle, when we could rebuild. Maybe this would make some of the cost figures easier to deal with. I don't understand your suggestion. What do you mean by "rebuildable"? What is the difference between recycling and rebuilding?
Are you suggesting that an EV battery be designed so that it can be easily taken apart, the parts which have worn out (plates?) replaced and then put back together again? Just how much of a worn out old battery can you use as-is in building a new unit?
Anthony
I guess I was just wondering what wears out in a battery and if it would be possible to restore that part of the battery. It might not be possible, but if a battery bank has 1000 deep cycles in it and you use it everyday, then it could get quite expensive.
Actually, because of recycling mandates, more than 97% of the materials,

including plates and boxes, in lead-acid batteries are currently being recycled into new batteries. Batteries are probably recycling's biggest success story. Dave Pyles

"Dave Pyles" wrote in message

On 8/25/2006 12:00 PM, SJC wrote: "Anthony Matonak" wrote in message SJC wrote: Something came to mind in the interest of having electric cars charged by renewable power. Maybe we could have rebuildable batteries, where the cost of the battery is paid for over time. It seems like a shame to just recycle, when we could rebuild. Maybe this would make some of the cost figures easier to deal with. I don't understand your suggestion. What do you mean by "rebuildable"? What is the difference between recycling and rebuilding?
Are you suggesting that an EV battery be designed so that it can be easily taken apart, the parts which have worn out (plates?) replaced and then put back together again? Just how much of a worn out old battery can you use as-is in building a new unit?
Anthony
I guess I was just wondering what wears out in a battery and if it would be possible to restore that part of the battery. It might not be possible, but if a battery bank has 1000 deep cycles in it and you use it everyday, then it could get quite expensive. Actually, because of recycling mandates, more than 97% of the materials, including plates and boxes, in lead-acid batteries are currently being recycled into new batteries. Batteries are probably recycling's biggest success story. Dave Pyles

Thanks for the response Dave. I knew lead-acid batteries were, but I did not know about NiMH or Lithium Ion. Recycling takes energy to smelt and reform, so when you add up recycling batteries for 100m EVs, it becomes significant.